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BFFmini
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BFFmini

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PostSubject: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeThu Feb 10, 2011 11:54 pm

Please explain... the dun gene for me.

If a horse has a dorsal stripe is it a dun??

or can it have a dorsal stripe and not be a dun?

Does it also have to have leg barring?

Does it modify the coat any other way?

Anything else you can explain to me??
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PONYKID
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PONYKID

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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 1:25 am

I couldn't help you any more without digging out my horse colours book, but I know that other colours can have dorsal stripe too.

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Dun 4 Dummies! Bfsiggy
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Sialer Park Mini Stud
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:33 am

Sign up here & ask your colour questions... Tis a genetics forum. Some of the members are the actual genetics gurus who do all the testing & research etc... You wont hear from better people.

http://forum.equine-color.info/
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Willowmoss
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 3:37 am

What a good forum. Im going to join and ask questions Smile
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Mystical
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 5:44 am

Okay dun-no how helpful I'll be but (sorry couldn't resist it)...

A horse can have a dorsal stripe and still not be a dun - a dun has to have a dun parent to be a true dun.

The dun gene lightens out the body (so black to slate colour - red's to apricots and so on) 6and leaves primitive markings the same colour as the mane and tail. The lightening affect doesn't usual change in the legs or the font of the face - leaving a darker mask. They have minimal iridescent and have a dorsal stripe, mask and leg barring (primitive markings). You can also get neck striping or shadowing, cobwebbing on the face and under the forelock, ear tips and edging, and guard hairs on the mane and or tail are coarse white hairs along either side, and mottling which appears as small dots or circles in shades darker than the body colour (not dapples) and isn't generally found on the horses winter coat and is found on the forearms, gaskins, shoulders and stifles. Not all primitive markings necessarily appear at the same time but with rare exceptions a true dun will have the dorsal tripe, mask and leg barring.

The dorsal stripe will be the same colour as the mane.

It is a dominant gene so it's presence is visible and affects all base colours. Usually dun to dun produces dun (75%). Horses that produce 100% have two dun parents.


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Mystical
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 5:58 am

Sorry meant to add if you have a horse with a dorsal stripe and the colour of the dorsal stripe is not the same colour as the mane - then it is not a dun.....
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Mystical
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 6:42 am

This fella is a grullo dun - just loved this boy..

Dun 4 Dummies! Dunstr10
when he ws just born - you can clearly see the dorsal stripe

Dun 4 Dummies! S8000710
in this picture you can see the darker patches over his shoulder and neck - as well as the outer hairs of his mane and tail being lighter colour - you can also just see the outter tips of his ear were a darker colour too - the same colour as his mask....

Dun 4 Dummies! S8000911
this boy was real special - his dorsal stripe went not only down his back into his tail but under his butt, tummy and straight up under his neck into his mask - you can also see small amount of leg barring

Dun 4 Dummies! Sir210
Just a cute picture - love it - his mask was so so dark

Dun 4 Dummies! Dun_ov10
again you can see all the markings needed to be a dun - in this case a grullo dun - ignore the patches on his neck and nose that had been clipped he had to have a needle and an absess drained - got a seed caught in his cheek poor baby.... but as his coat lightened up you could really see all his primative markings...

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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:14 pm

BFFmini wrote:
Please explain... the dun gene for me.

If a horse has a dorsal stripe is it a dun??

or can it have a dorsal stripe and not be a dun?

Does it also have to have leg barring?

Does it modify the coat any other way?

Anything else you can explain to me??


Hi BFFmini, we specialise in breeding Dun and Dilute minis and Welsh.So will answer a few of your questions for you.

Just because a horse has a dorsal stripe does not mean it is a dun...

To be a dun they also have to have other dun factor markings, ie- dorsal stripe/fish boning, leg barring/mottling ,face mask/cob webbing, shoulder stripe/shadow, lighter body coat showing darker legs and head, ear tipping and/or barring.

We own four duns and have bred four duns.All have the dorsal and leg barring.All the ones we have seen and know have both dorsal and leg barring,the other factors vary with each horse and season.

All of our ponies/horses are true Duns. and they all have all the factors,just some are stronger than the others.Our red Dun stallion loses alot of his markings from August to December--YAY just in time for our ROYAL,makes me a wee bit upset...But he still kicks Butt...
and then we have a couple that stay the same all year round and two that show their markings in winter coat really well.So they are all different.We will post some piks of some of ours and give you an idea on different markings.

We have been looking at Duns all over Australia and so far only 2% have actually been True Duns.There are so many buckskins with dorsal stripes advertised as duns and there are also Duns but they have patches or spots breeding.We only breed solid Duns.(tested negative for broken colour and spots)

Hope this has helped.

Our red Dun Stallion...

Dun 4 Dummies! 034-Copy

Dun 4 Dummies! 044-12

Dun 4 Dummies! 051-8

Dun 4 Dummies! 023-15


Last edited by mineees on Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:18 pm

Our home bred Buckskin Dun Filly...

Dun 4 Dummies! Scan0004-3

Dun 4 Dummies! 122-5

Dun 4 Dummies! 061-5

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Dun 4 Dummies! 069-12
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:20 pm

Our home bred Buckskin Dun Colt...

Dun 4 Dummies! 140-3

Dun 4 Dummies! 147-5

Dun 4 Dummies! 146-4

Dun 4 Dummies! 093-6

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Dun 4 Dummies! 034-11
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:22 pm

Our home bred Red Dun Colt...

Dun 4 Dummies! Scan0003-1

Dun 4 Dummies! 238-1

Dun 4 Dummies! 134-2
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:25 pm

Our QPony filly we bought from Vic...

Dun 4 Dummies! 094-Copy

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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:28 pm

our Silver Dun mare...

Now we have learnt more about the Duns,we have decided silver is not a good combination,as it masks the Dun markings.So far Harmony hasnt given us a silver...

Dun 4 Dummies! 007-17

Dun 4 Dummies! 1742

Dun 4 Dummies! 063-5
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 2:38 pm

now for the science of it, from what we have read,Dun is not actually a Gene.They look for markers from both parents and the subject horse.We have not been able to find out if these markers are within or hanging off or between the actual Genes. When you test for colour you test for ie-Cream you test for a copy of the Cream Gene,when you test for Dun you test for Dun Factor.Its a Dun Zygosity Test...This test is a similarity of a combination of Genes rather than a specific gene.From what we understand.

sunny
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BFFmini
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 11:28 pm

Thank you, everyone, for the lesson in DUN.... I love the markings... they look amazing.

I have a much better understanding of the Dun Factor now. cheers
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deltree
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeFri Feb 11, 2011 11:41 pm

Wow Mineees, you're full of cool knowledge! These were really interesting posts to read!
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mineees
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PostSubject: Re: Dun 4 Dummies!   Dun 4 Dummies! Icon_minitimeSat Feb 12, 2011 1:01 pm

deltree wrote:
Wow Mineees, you're full of cool knowledge! These were really interesting posts to read!


Thank's ... We have studied the genetics for quite some time now, reading everything we can find on the subject. Especially the dun and cream, but we have also learnt about all the other modifiers and colours on the way as they are all passed on in the same way but some can be carried and not shown. We have found it all very interesting. Also we are hoping to get to the point of being able to know exactly what we are going to breed before they get here we just won't know the sex .In other words we can breed to order... So the foal will have a home even before conception ...
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